WWE Thread (No spoilers) & classic WWF/E talk

[Big Boss Man]

A topic to discuss WWE with no spoilers!. Also thought old school WWWF/WWF can be discussed too so its dual purpose.

Still making my way through the 5+ hours of Mania, about two hours in so far, so thats why I havent posted in the normal WWE topic.

[Big Boss Man]

I ain't watched The Rumble yet but when I do I'll add my thoughts. Had the winner spoiled though thanks to Sky Sports News

[Bandit]

Where is evetybody? Avoiding spoilers a week later?

Come on, if you haven't watched Backlash nearly a week later, you're not going to watch it.

[Dr. Zoidberg]

I've had the flu this week, which kicked in on the day of the PPV, so didn't watch it. A good week to get sick judging from the reviews.

[Bandit]

Yes, only watch it if you want to see a historically awful show. The average WON star rating was 2.05.

[Big Boss Man]

Where is evetybody? Avoiding spoilers a week later?

Come on, if you haven't watched Backlash nearly a week later, you're not going to watch it.

Still haven't finished the Saudi show yet
I'll get to Backlash eventually. Been watching the NBA playoffs instead

[Bandit]

Where is evetybody? Avoiding spoilers a week later?

Come on, if you haven't watched Backlash nearly a week later, you're not going to watch it.

Still haven't finished the Saudi show yet
I'll get to Backlash eventually. Been watching the NBA playoffs instead

Don't bother with Backlash, it's been called one of the top 5 worst WWE shows ever.

[Big Boss Man]

That bad? Must be Road Dogg booking it I guess. The Nak punching AJ in the nuts gimmick reminds me of

[Bandit]

It's not split brand anymore, he didn't book it.

Michael Hayes produced the very poorly received Samoa Joe vs. Roman Reigns main event at WWE Backlash tonight. The run sheet for tonight's show was leaked earlier this evening.

Below is the full list of tonight's matches and who produced each:

Bayley Vs. Ruby Riott: TJ Wilson and Dean Malenko
The Miz Vs. Seth Rollins: TJ Wilson
Alexa Bliss Vs. Nia Jax: Sarah Stock
Randy Orton Vs. Jeff Hardy: Arn Anderson
Elias segment: Scott Armstrong
Daniel Bryan Vs. Big Cass: Jamie Noble and Dean Malenko
Charlotte Flair Vs. Carmella: John Laurinaitis
AJ Styles vs. Shinsuke Nakamura: Jamie Noble
Braun Strowman & Bobby Lashley Vs. Kevin Owens & Sami Zayn: Mike Rotunda & D-Von Dudley
Roman Reigns vs. Samoa Joe: Michael Hayes

Must have been awkward that Cena's new girlfriend Carmella had to work with Nikki's stepfather.

[Bandit]

I watched the first head to head Raw & Nitro last night.

It was so clear why WCW won for 2 and 1/2 years just from this comparison. WCW was throwing everything they had into this show and it felt so fresh. But Raw was just your average mid-90s WWF show.

NITRO

-Bischoff buries WWF and gives away Raw results at the top of the show. He did a great job of making it feel like only the cool people watched Nitro and Raw was for morons. Unfortunately they completely forgot what made them seem cooler by fall 1998.

-It's funny that now WWE announcing is so awful Mongo doesn't come off as bad as he seemed in the 90s when we were always spoiled with good announcing. As bad as he was, he'd been seen as an improvement if they put him on Raw now.

-Bischoff having actual enthusiasm unlike today also comes across as much better. He doesn't know anything about wrestling, but he makes it sound like you're watching the greatest shit ever.

-Toned Down Sabu vs Alex Wright was pretty good. When Bischoff mentions The Sheik Mongo thinks he means Iron Sheik. WWF was running a dull Razor vs Bulldog match against this.

-It's interesting in the Flair/Arn feud that Ric bashes Arn for wanting to be with his family instead of party with him. That's actually how their friendship really ended 10 years later.

-VK Wallstreet is just a ghetto Million Dollar Man. Just awful and nobody cares about the gimmick.

-The finish of John Tenta accidentally trapping Scott Norton so Savage could hit the elbow drop was great. Savage was working his ass off whereas in Hogan's match he does Just Enough. That illustrated the difference between them.

-They really shit on Luger immediately. Hogan gives him nothing in their match. He gave more to Big Bubba Rogers on the last episode. He was out to cut him off immediately. And Bischoff didn't care. Stupid.

RAW

-Razor Ramon vs British Bulldog was awful. I love both guys, but they worked the most generic match you've ever seen. This was taped 3 weeks before airing, so they didn't have the urgency they needed to fend off Nitro and it really showed here. Remember Nitro had Sabu doing dives that a lot of fans had never seen before against this.

-123 Kid and Ramon feud is okay. They didn't really do enough with it because Waltman was in and out with his bad neck injury. So their main match besides the diaper match was a tag with Sid and Jannetty so he didn't have to bump as much.

-Smokin Gunns vs Brooklyn Brawler and Rad Radford was awful. Vince and Lawler mostly ignored the match so Lawler could do pop culture references. The commentary was live, so Lawler would take a match to make jokes about celebrities in the tabloids that week to make you think the whole show was live.

-The future Kane wrestled the future Scotty 2 Hotty in a squash match.

-Shawn vs Sid was okay. Their Survivor Series and Royal Rumble matches were much better. But it was a good TV main event for the day.

-Shawn made me laugh in the most-match promo when he said the new tag team name for him and Diesel was "Two Chaps with All the Straps."

BETTER SHOW: Nitro by far for feeling exciting.

RATINGS: Raw won 2.5 to 2.4

ECW FROM THAT WEEKEND

-Pitbulls interview challenging Stevie Richards and Raven to a double dog collar match.

-Classic heel Cactus Jack promo on Dreamer. The one where he talked about the old wrestlers he knows who are broken down even though they did less tha he and Dreamer do.

-Dudley Dudley vs Tommy Dreamer

-Taz interview talking about his broken neck and the progress he's making toward returning.

-Steiner Brothers vs Chris Benoit and 2 Cold Scorpio (this was Benoit's last ECW match)

-The original Pulp Fiction montage promo. Public Enemy talk about Gangstas, New Jack talks about Public Enemy, Sandman sides with the Gangstas, Mikey Whipwreck says he has to man up and fight Sandman because he's tired of being bullied.

[Bandit]

http://people.com/tv/john-cena-wants-fa ... f-wedding/

OMG SWERVE!!

[Big Boss Man]

What are the odds for a WrestleMania wedding? Surprised the British press are picking this up still. Someone like Meltzer could have a field day planting kayfabe wrestling stories as real.

[Big Boss Man]

Haven't watched MITB so will avoid the main WWE thread.

[Bandit]

Watch the Hardys documentary on the Network, it's great.

[Big Boss Man]

Thanks, will check that out. Doesn't it include the Final Deletion footage.

[Bandit]

Yeah it covers Omega through the Matt and Bray tag team and Jeff on Smackdown, including TNA footage. It's only an hour but they pack in so much.

[Big Boss Man]

OK cool, sounds really good.

[Big Boss Man]

Haven't watched Extreme Rules yet but heard Hogan has been "reinstated" back to the WWE Hall of Fame. Real disappointed in WWE doing this because he hasn't even genuinely apologized. The "I was drunk and in a bad place brother" put on the crocodile tears act doesn't count because it was for the cameras and to me, it was insincere. Yes other wrestlers are known racists or racist on the down low too, but there's actual evidence in Hulk's instance & he is the Babe Ruth of WWE and for many former fans/mainstream audience he's synonymous with pro-wrestling & WWE . Speaking of WWE, they don't need Hogan, his drawing power nowadays is minimal, the negative stigma attached to him will be detrimental since you will be alienating a lot of your fanbase by pandering to him. Fans have been talking about cancelling their network subscriptions and boycotting the WWE too & rightly so. Since there's no place for a racist in 2018 and shouldn't ever be a place for racism period. The Moolah battle royale thing got shutdown but I can't see WWE kicking him out of the HOF for a second time.

[Bandit]

So far he's just reinstated into the WWE HOF, he hasn't signed a deal to be back on TV or anything. So if that's all it is I don't care. What he did was bad enough to where he shouldn't be involved with their modern product, but I don't think so bad they need to act like his accomplishments in the 1980s should be downplayed. Before Hogan only Chris Benoit ever got that kind of treatment. They removed Snuka from the HOF too, but remember when he died they gave him a loving tribute video package and a tribute week on WWE Network.



So if people are going to boycott over Hogan (they probably won't) but not boycott when a murderer got tributes to the same level as Dusty and Piper when they died, I think that's strange. Racism is bad, but it's not beating a woman to death and then lying about it for 30 years (if apologies are their problem with Hogan.)

[Big Boss Man]

Really good point about Snuka. He adopted a similar stance to what Hulk did where they don't take full responsibility for their actions. I think the story was Vince turned into the clean up man & Superfly went into full gimmick "I don't understand brudda" mode which can you imagine any detective or senior police buying that story?. Its like something out of the Fargo TV show. I agree you can't compare murder to racism. But you have to remember Hulk Hogan was a role model to kids of all races and a real life superhero to them. Granted as adults they should realise he's shady when he blatantly lied on Arsenio about steroids etc. Plus with today's racial climate, a "hero" spouting racial slurs and it was also in jail calls to Nick so it wasn't a one off deal either. So in that context its a big deal. Its like if a major black athlete/rapper/singer etc came out and said "Fvck white people" and used anti white slurs they'd be an uproar, yet if you reverse it its downplayed & swept under the rug. I don't think that's right or fair. Racism is just pathetic at its core, but there's a double standard going on, which is why people are up in arms about it. Hulk was Mr Good Guy yet he was shooting up steroids and could have been racist back in the day too on the down low.

What Snuka did "allegedly" is terrible and them glorifying him whilst deleting Benoit from history is incredibly hypocritical. We know the wrestling biz is carny to the nth degree but WWE should try and be morally responsible. But you have former drug users (steroids/prescription/recreational), domestic abusers, racists alleged and blatant then if they went on a purge to clean up their public image the HOF would be near to empty. I have a feeling they will bring Hogan back to TV to plug WWE 2K19 & probably do a skit with the New Day, there's a special about him coming up on the Network, they'll put Rock & Wrestling back on there, put him back in the opening video before each show etc etc. If he had come out and genuinely was sorry then I'd give him a 2nd chance but he was like be careful what you say and do in public cause they record it like he's pissed he got caught out. So for his nonchalant attitude and not taking accountability for his actions that means a lot of his former fans won't forgive him & they have the right to do so. Because they thought he was a man of honesty and integrity (which is gimmick was all about) yet he was a liar (blantantly did so on TV) and a racist. Or somebody who has a racist ideology which is just as bad in my book.

I get that Snuka is much worse but he wasn't held in the same regard as Hogan was. He'd be a footnote in wrestling history whereas Hulk Hogan to many is pro-wrestling,he's deeply ingrained in WWE history. By associating with a person who has evidence of saying racial slurs, with his standing in pro wrestling it sends out a negative message and from a mainstream pov makes WWE look like they condone racism.